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Jan 28, 2015 22:39:18 GMT
Post by snoopy11 on Jan 28, 2015 22:39:18 GMT
A friend of mine has just bought a MGB (or Austin sports coupe as Mr P would prefer to name them) with a bit of a difference.
I very clever ever bloke has managed to get a 1990's Honda/Rover 2200 litre 16 valve engine in mounted onto a Rover Sdi gear box. Apparently it has made a very smooth and powerful car returning good mpg that is very comfortable in modern traffic
apparently the engine is basicly an uprated B series engine and in the Honda / Rover it is already front wheel drive
Not that I'm planning anything but I did wonder if the rover engine and gearbox would drop into a crab. I would think the brakes as they are would be good enough but would the drive shafts and gear lever linkages line up.
Anyone any thoughts ?
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Jan 29, 2015 0:28:43 GMT
Post by Penguin45 on Jan 29, 2015 0:28:43 GMT
I suppose that if a transverse drive engine can be dropped into the "hole", it's just a matter of making the drive side work. Sadly the chap who made bespoke driveshafts in Leeds retired a couple of years back, so I don't know who does that now. There is a thread somewhere on here of an Oz 'Crab with (I think) a Nissan engine in it, and very neatly done as well.
I'll see if I can find it.
Chris.
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Jan 29, 2015 0:35:28 GMT
Post by snoopy11 on Jan 29, 2015 0:35:28 GMT
I suppose that if a transverse drive engine can be dropped into the "hole", it's just a matter of making the drive side work. Sadly the chap who made bespoke driveshafts in Leeds retired a couple of years back, so I don't know who does that now. There is a thread somewhere on here of an Oz 'Crab with (I think) a Nissan engine in it, and very neatly done as well. I'll see if I can find it. Chris. Thanks Chris. Its more an interest thing but it does compute when you consider the costs of rebuilding a classic engine
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Jan 29, 2015 2:06:24 GMT
Post by dave1800 on Jan 29, 2015 2:06:24 GMT
There was a crab in South Africa with a Mazda 6 engine and gearbox if I recall correctly. There is also the "wild" racer LeMons 1800You may wish to read Julian Edgar's attempt to transplant a more modern engine and transmission into a 1800 Ute. There are lots more goodies on his website well worth reading. Here is a link to Part 1 of the article which is also being serialised in the LOCI magazine. Autospeed Landcrab UTE It may be worth exploring whether the "O" series engine (Princess / Ambassador etc) and its "M" series derivative (Rover 820)are options that could be fitted to the Crab gearbox which is quite strong. The blocks on these engines are fundamentally the same as the B series. The big problem is space, or lack of it especially when it comes to fitting fuel injection and manifolds. While I find these transplants a fascinating challenge, now that there are so few crabs left I personally feel it is better to try and keep them to original or rally specs, but that's just my opinion. MGBs on the other hand are so plentiful... David
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Jan 29, 2015 17:26:07 GMT
Post by Penguin45 on Jan 29, 2015 17:26:07 GMT
Found it - HERE. Beautifully done, but I do still have that little nagging thought - "Why?"! Chris.
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Jan 29, 2015 19:24:26 GMT
Post by indianajones on Jan 29, 2015 19:24:26 GMT
I agree with Snoopy, when one compares the cost of a rebuild and what you get in return compared to a modern engine transplant, it is viable option. But at the same time I agree with David, their are not many left now and I think we should keep them as original as practically possible (that said, I am no concours man etc).
If someone were to buy a 'dead' crab and get it back on the road with a new engine, I'd have no issue with it (It's something I have considered doing myself one day, perhaps with a Turbo L series engine).
Of course at the end of the day, it's the owners car and they can do what they want to it, even paint it pink, lower it, stick on a body kit and start cruising the streets lol
-Andrew
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Post by faulks on Jan 29, 2015 20:40:15 GMT
Delurking on the subject of engine transplants, I bought a copy of Classic and Sportscar to help pass the time on a train journey last week. There's a piece in it by Martin Buckley, who's rebuilding an Austin 3 litre and installing the engine from a van den Plas 4 litre R as a variation on a period theme. Quite a good article, but I can't find it online.
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Jan 29, 2015 22:12:58 GMT
Post by snoopy11 on Jan 29, 2015 22:12:58 GMT
Found it - HERE. Beautifully done, but I do still have that little nagging thought - "Why?"! Chris. I suppose the answer to why is "because they can" and have the knowledge to do it. As as you know with my old red kit car that was producing 160 bhp and that had a fortune put into the engine. At the end of the day it was still a 2 litre pinto that was so highly strung it was hard work and always off the cam around town. A modern engine like the ford zetec will produce 110 to 120 bhp straight out of the box and have the power right across the range. In short it's a quick and relatively cheap tuning option if you have the skills.
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Jan 29, 2015 22:42:47 GMT
Post by Nick RS on Jan 29, 2015 22:42:47 GMT
Sounds like the MGB has a Rover M16 engine from a Rover 800 or possibly the later development which was the T series. I occasionally had an R800 when I worked for the firm and they were always very flexible and amazingly economical? 40mpg was not too difficult to get in this big car. From memory there wasn't a joint Rover / Honda engine, the cars usually had one or another. The 2.0 litre 800s used the engine above, the 2.7 V6 was a smooth but thirsty Honda. The 2.0 might fit a crab as it was as Snoopy says developed from the O series which in turn was developed from the B. The 800 was also a narrow car to comply with car width restrictions imposed by Japanese regulations that affected the joint 800 / Legend project. That lack of width may mean there is a more compact engine arrangement that could help the crab converter. Lesser known fact is that the 800 also took the O series in a fairly short lived 820 base fastback.
I wouldn't put a different engine in myself but I find it fascinating to see what others do. Wasn't there a landcrab with V8 in Australia built by BMC BL?
Nick
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Jan 30, 2015 0:26:29 GMT
Post by Penguin45 on Jan 30, 2015 0:26:29 GMT
I don't know about the Oz V8 - maybe Crabmaster has some info. There was a 'Rodded 'Crab hearse about with a Rover V8 and rear wheel drive some years back. I saw it at South Cerney in 2004. Rumour has it that it's been scrapped.
MG prototyped an MGB with a "O" engine, but nothing came of it. I think there's some bumf about it on the excellent AROnline.
Chris.
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Jan 30, 2015 12:52:17 GMT
Post by Nick RS on Jan 30, 2015 12:52:17 GMT
There are details of the V8 on Tony's Austalia 1800 wbesite. It was part of the P76 development programme and mounted a Rover 3.5 V8 in a north-south arrangement. This is just begging to be recreated by someone with oodles of skill. Members can access the magazine articles and read about it in the July 1973 edition of Wheels magazine.
Nick
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Jan 30, 2015 19:35:50 GMT
Post by Penguin45 on Jan 30, 2015 19:35:50 GMT
That does seem a rather bizarre route to take when the 3 Litre was available with rear drive already in place. There was a Wolseley 3½ Litre prototype built by BL. Again, nothing came of it.
Chris.
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crabmaster
Member
Posts: 44
Attribute: http://www.austineighteenhundred.com.au
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Jan 31, 2015 12:16:53 GMT
Post by crabmaster on Jan 31, 2015 12:16:53 GMT
Nick is quite right to mention the Australian V8 Austin 1800. This was a mock-up vehicle that was intended to demonstrate what BMC thought would be the optimum configuration for a large car to compete with local products from Ford and GMH. North South V8 engine with 4 litre capacity, front wheel drive, and hydrolastic suspension were the key design points. The engine was a Rover 3.5 with a modified single-plane crankshaft to give a 4.2 litre capacity - it became known as the "Viber8". The transmission was a Borg Warner 35 with custom castings and drop gears so as to drive the normal 1800 drive shafts. The whole front of the car had to be reworked with a new firewall, suspension displacers positioned vertically, and 4 inches added to the length of the bonnet and front guards. It also had a different steering column and rack. Its performance was reported to be outstanding, but when costed against conventional rear wheel drive, was noncompetitive and so the idea did not go any further than the demonstration vehicle. I asked Barry Anderson, what became of the car. It was last photographed in the mid 1970's about the time of the factory closure. It is said that the car was supposed to be shipped to Rover UK but no one would pick up the cost. Most of those who were involved say that the power unit eventually made it to Rover, but the body was broken up - it not being rotodipped and did not remain roadworthy for very long. So, if anyone in UK could ask at Rover if they have it, some information about its location would be much appreciated in Australia. Tony Attachments:
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Feb 1, 2015 0:43:09 GMT
Post by Penguin45 on Feb 1, 2015 0:43:09 GMT
Thanks Tony. Fascinating to see what looks like MacPherson strut towers worked into the engine bay. You get the feeling with these later projects that they were grasping at straws.
Chris.
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crabmaster
Member
Posts: 44
Attribute: http://www.austineighteenhundred.com.au
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Engine
Feb 1, 2015 9:39:19 GMT
Post by crabmaster on Feb 1, 2015 9:39:19 GMT
Some more interesting photos. This must have cost the company a fortune: one-off castings for bell housing and transmission, totally reworked body from A pillar forward. Work on the car began in mid 1968 and took about a year to complete. It was never shown to the UK management. Tony
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